goliathvt@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 8:12 am :
For those that are too young to remember, the Bush I campaign latched onto a racist 3rd party TV ad back in 1988 to show how Bush's opponent, Michael Dukakis was "soft" on crime. It featured the mug shot of Willie Horton, a black man, convicted of rape and murder who, despite a life sentence, was released on a weekend furlough and during which raped a white woman.

The Bush I administration rode that fear-mongering racist pony and went from being way down in the polls to sitting in the White House.

Well, I give you the "Willie Horton" story of 2008:

Say hello to Ashely Todd. She, a McCain campaign volunteer working for the National College Republican Committee, told police:

Quote:
...that on Wednesday night a black man robbed her of $60 at an ATM in Bloomfield, Pa.

She said the robber then noticed the McCain bumper sticker on her car, punched her in the back of her head, knocked her down and beat her, saying "you are going to be a Barack supporter." He pinned her down and scratched the "B" on the right side of her face before fleeing, according to her original story.

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/24 ... tack-hoax/


Image

Actually, let's say goodbye to Ashley Todd as she has now confessed it was all a hoax, totally made up. She's been carted off in handcuffs and will probably undergo evaluation for mental health.

Image

So, okay, you've got a white republican trying to scare folks about a fictitious black "Obama supporter." Does that matter? Maybe... I'd like to think that we have gotten past the point of us being scared out of our wits by racially-charged fear-mongering... but who knows.

What I find additionally troubling though, is that apparently without any police investigation or confirmation, the McCain campaign staff in PA gave out quotes of the victim's description of the attack and especially the tidbit about the "B" standing for Barack Obama.

Now, I can understand why McCain campaign workers might hear the account first since the woman was a volunteer and she was on her way to some rally or event or something... but for me, I'm disgusted to see how this information was then pushed out by the campaign spokespeople to reporters without even an attempt to validate it.

Scare tactics at their best, I guess. Well, the story is now biting them in the ass and even FoxNews concedes that a "race-bait" scandal will likely finish the McCain campaign for good.



BNA!@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 9:20 am :
I am sorry, but what has McCain to do with a mentally troubled person?

I would like to see less "blow out of proportions" approaches to politics and more focus on facts and applicable solutions. We already see far too much tribal behaviour in the press.

What does it matter for a racist that the stylist of Sarah Palin is far better paid than the political advisor of McCain? What does it matter for a radical left wing person that Obama may or may not look for his birth certificate in Hawaii?

These things are of zip zero nothing importance, a waste of time, money and space. These are the arguments of last resort, the "your politician is worse than my politician" game which is on the same level as 4 year olds playing in a sandbox.

I get more and more the impression this election got taken out of the hand of the voting population and has become a playball for the respective extreme 5% on each end. Where is the voice of reason by the remaining 90% of the US population calling the candidates off from their derailed paths to refocus on the pressing day to day issues ready to emerge after the election?

Skyrocketing unemployment, money printed beyond all means, deflationary cycles which may swing to hyperinflation, world economy risks beyond what we've seen for a long time, ~15 millions (and couting) of US households with negative equity in their mortgages, the same old solutions of drilling more to keep energy prices down (drinking faster wont increase the amount of water in a bottle), tax this and tax cut that...

Both campaigns spend too much of their resources on spin doctors, but who is offering solutions?



rich_is_bored@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 11:33 am :
That 90% is more like 8% and we'll be voting third party.



BNA!@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 1:28 pm :
rich_is_bored wrote:
That 90% is more like 8% and we'll be voting third party.


You mean the balanced minds represent the extremes? Something like radical balance...? Forced intelligence? Extremist IQ?



goliathvt@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 3:03 pm :
BNA! wrote:
I am sorry, but what has McCain to do with a mentally troubled person?


McCain campaign workers in PA started pushing the "B stands for Obama" portion of the story and emphasizing that it was a McCain volunteer attacked by an "Obama supporter," obviously trying to tap into the fear and racism of the American public. That is reprehensible, if you ask me.

Quote:
I would like to see less "blow out of proportions" approaches to politics and more focus on facts and applicable solutions. We already see far too much tribal behaviour in the press.

These things are of zip zero nothing importance, a waste of time, money and space. These are the arguments of last resort, the "your politician is worse than my politician" game which is on the same level as 4 year olds playing in a sandbox.


I agree completely. Yet all the McCain campaign seems able to muster at this point are wild, baseless attacks or yelling some mantra about "palling around with terrorists" or "ACORN is the devil!" or whatever. And, while I'd much prefer the candidates debate substantive issues, the overwhelming sling of mud coming out of the McCain campaign shouldn't go unanswered or ignored because, as I mentioned in the start of my post, just 10 years ago similar racist fear-based mud-slinging bullshit allowed the first George Bush to gain in the polls and defeat his opponent.

Quote:
I get more and more the impression this election got taken out of the hand of the voting population and has become a playball for the respective extreme 5% on each end. Where is the voice of reason by the remaining 90% of the US population calling the candidates off from their derailed paths to refocus on the pressing day to day issues ready to emerge after the election?


Actually, I've seen a voice of reason out of the Obama camp than any other presidential candidate in recent history, and that's one of the reasons why I like him. For example, while he does have ads questioning McCains ties to Charles Keating and Libby (which unlike the Obama-Ayers business, ARE real ties and friendships to convicted crooks and terrorists), he never really slammed it home during debates or public speeches. He never even allows his crowds to "boo" the other guy.

And he also has been talking to a lot more than 5% of the population in terms of the policies of his tax and health care plans. He's hardly a saint, but I've heard a lot more "this is my policy and here are my plans for office" out of Obama than I have heard from McCain. In order to get any understanding of John McCain's policies, I have to go read his website... I don't get any clear info from his campaign speeches... they're all full of venom spitting, half-truths and flag-waving bullshit.

The contrast between these two candidates is why I view "Obama" to be "better than the other crappy choices."



goliathvt@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 3:09 pm :
BNA! wrote:
rich_is_bored wrote:
That 90% is more like 8% and we'll be voting third party.


You mean the balanced minds represent the extremes? Something like radical balance...? Forced intelligence? Extremist IQ?


I think he's alluding to the fact that if you are a truly independent thinker and want to vote for a candidate that does speak a voice of reason and doesn't pander to the extremist crowd, then you're a small minority of the population and you'll probably be voting 3rd party.

If I wasn't so terrified of having yet-another-Bush-esque candidate in office, I would be voting 3rd party and not for Obama. The country, and dare I say the world, cannot handle what seems like would be the reactionary war-hawkish and economically clueless presidency of John McCain. And god forbit he died during office and Sarah "I don't know what a VP does except I want to disregard the Constitution and give me more power!" Palin took the reigns.

My vote is more "defensive" than anything else.



aardwolf@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 5:54 pm :
BNA! wrote:
I am sorry, but what has McCain to do with a mentally troubled person?

I would like to see less "blow out of proportions" approaches to politics and more focus on facts and applicable solutions. We already see far too much tribal behaviour in the press.

What does it matter for a racist that the stylist of Sarah Palin is far better paid than the political advisor of McCain? What does it matter for a radical left wing person that Obama may or may not look for his birth certificate in Hawaii?

These things are of zip zero nothing importance, a waste of time, money and space. These are the arguments of last resort, the "your politician is worse than my politician" game which is on the same level as 4 year olds playing in a sandbox.

I get more and more the impression this election got taken out of the hand of the voting population and has become a playball for the respective extreme 5% on each end. Where is the voice of reason by the remaining 90% of the US population calling the candidates off from their derailed paths to refocus on the pressing day to day issues ready to emerge after the election?

Skyrocketing unemployment, money printed beyond all means, deflationary cycles which may swing to hyperinflation, world economy risks beyond what we've seen for a long time, ~15 millions (and couting) of US households with negative equity in their mortgages, the same old solutions of drilling more to keep energy prices down (drinking faster wont increase the amount of water in a bottle), tax this and tax cut that...

Both campaigns spend too much of their resources on spin doctors, but who is offering solutions?


Dont you get it? Those big problems arent going to be addressed, so these media circuses are placed instead as a smokescreen so that the vast population will be busy with it, and dont demand these problems to be addressed. it's all a show. We're not seeing the owners of the circus, just the clowns. The owners are sitting confortably on their 1billion dollar resorts, watching all these from their holographic screens, while scheduling the next annual Bilderberg meeting.



BNA!@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 7:18 pm :
goliathvt wrote:
BNA! wrote:
rich_is_bored wrote:
That 90% is more like 8% and we'll be voting third party.


You mean the balanced minds represent the extremes? Something like radical balance...? Forced intelligence? Extremist IQ?


I think he's alluding to the fact that if you are a truly independent thinker and want to vote for a candidate that does speak a voice of reason and doesn't pander to the extremist crowd, then you're a small minority of the population and you'll probably be voting 3rd party.


I understood what he wrote, did you understand the cynicism of my reply ;)



BNA!@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 7:32 pm :
aardwolf wrote:
Dont you get it? Those big problems arent going to be addressed, so these media circuses are placed instead as a smokescreen so that the vast population will be busy with it, and dont demand these problems to be addressed. it's all a show. We're not seeing the owners of the circus, just the clowns. The owners are sitting confortably on their 1billion dollar resorts, watching all these from their holographic screens, while scheduling the next annual Bilderberg meeting.


I get a whole lot more than the average person. How many people do you know personally or did you speak to attending the Bilderberg meeting? There are plenty of Bilderberg meeting in the world, every day everywhere. Basically whenever you cramp a handful of CEOs into a room in Sun Valley or elsewhere you can make an empty claim of "them" or "they" or otherwise secret "skulls" or "Freemason" conspiracy stuff.

The capital always had the power in any system, may it be capitalist or communist. Some claim with some potential logic we've seen Dick Cheney as circus owner and a public decoy named George W. Bush as the "clown" to give things a face. Is it true? Well, as true as any other construct which is of undeniable logic yet unproven.

People always believe in the mystery. God over evolution, conspiracies over monetary interest... The devils best trick was to make people believe he didn't exist, the trick of a conspiracy is to make people believe missing proof is the proof.



zeh@Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:16 am :
If what I've on the intertubes is true, she was previously a Ron Paul supporter and was kicked out the campaign work for that candidate for similar reasons, when she feigned an attack in her car.

More on McCain's campaign quick abuse of the issue:
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpoints ... rs_inc.php



rich_is_bored@Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:18 am :
Really? Wow. How do you go from Ron Paul to McCain?



BNA!@Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 10:20 am :
rich_is_bored wrote:
Really? Wow. How do you go from Ron Paul to McCain?


She figured cutting a "B" into her face wouldn't hurt as much as a "McCain".?



zeh@Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:00 pm :
rich_is_bored wrote:
Really? Wow. How do you go from Ron Paul to McCain?


No idea, but I honestly think her act is a sign of some sort of racial prejudice and jumping from supporting one non-black candidate to the other in a race against a black man would be a fairly straightforward decision. Not that it applies to anyone else though.

Anyway, I didn't quite believe it at first, but apparently the thing's true btw:
http://wonkette.com/403807/ashley-todd- ... or-freedom
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08299/922849-53.stm

Quote:
In March, Ms. Todd was asked to leave a grass-roots group of Ron Paul supporters in Brazos County, Texas, group leader Dustan Costine said. He said Ms. Todd posed as a supporter of former Arkansas governor and presidential candidate Mike Huckabee and called the local Republican committee seeking information about its campaign strategies.

"She would call the opposing campaign and pretend she was on their campaign to get information," Mr. Costine said last night. "We had to remove her because of the tactics she displayed. After that we had nothing to do with her."

About a month earlier, he said, Ms. Todd sent an e-mail to the Ron Paul group saying her tires were slashed and that campaign paraphernalia had been stolen from her car because she supported Mr. Paul.

"She's the type of person who wants to be recognized," Mr. Costine said.


The girl needs help, but for one thing I'm happy she assumed she lied and ended the whole debacle so early, before it got turned into a shitstorm for both sides and tainted the discussion even more. At least she didn't believe her own lies.



goliathvt@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 8:12 am :
For those that are too young to remember, the Bush I campaign latched onto a racist 3rd party TV ad back in 1988 to show how Bush's opponent, Michael Dukakis was "soft" on crime. It featured the mug shot of Willie Horton, a black man, convicted of rape and murder who, despite a life sentence, was released on a weekend furlough and during which raped a white woman.

The Bush I administration rode that fear-mongering racist pony and went from being way down in the polls to sitting in the White House.

Well, I give you the "Willie Horton" story of 2008:

Say hello to Ashely Todd. She, a McCain campaign volunteer working for the National College Republican Committee, told police:

Quote:
...that on Wednesday night a black man robbed her of $60 at an ATM in Bloomfield, Pa.

She said the robber then noticed the McCain bumper sticker on her car, punched her in the back of her head, knocked her down and beat her, saying "you are going to be a Barack supporter." He pinned her down and scratched the "B" on the right side of her face before fleeing, according to her original story.

http://elections.foxnews.com/2008/10/24 ... tack-hoax/


Image

Actually, let's say goodbye to Ashley Todd as she has now confessed it was all a hoax, totally made up. She's been carted off in handcuffs and will probably undergo evaluation for mental health.

Image

So, okay, you've got a white republican trying to scare folks about a fictitious black "Obama supporter." Does that matter? Maybe... I'd like to think that we have gotten past the point of us being scared out of our wits by racially-charged fear-mongering... but who knows.

What I find additionally troubling though, is that apparently without any police investigation or confirmation, the McCain campaign staff in PA gave out quotes of the victim's description of the attack and especially the tidbit about the "B" standing for Barack Obama.

Now, I can understand why McCain campaign workers might hear the account first since the woman was a volunteer and she was on her way to some rally or event or something... but for me, I'm disgusted to see how this information was then pushed out by the campaign spokespeople to reporters without even an attempt to validate it.

Scare tactics at their best, I guess. Well, the story is now biting them in the ass and even FoxNews concedes that a "race-bait" scandal will likely finish the McCain campaign for good.



BNA!@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 9:20 am :
I am sorry, but what has McCain to do with a mentally troubled person?

I would like to see less "blow out of proportions" approaches to politics and more focus on facts and applicable solutions. We already see far too much tribal behaviour in the press.

What does it matter for a racist that the stylist of Sarah Palin is far better paid than the political advisor of McCain? What does it matter for a radical left wing person that Obama may or may not look for his birth certificate in Hawaii?

These things are of zip zero nothing importance, a waste of time, money and space. These are the arguments of last resort, the "your politician is worse than my politician" game which is on the same level as 4 year olds playing in a sandbox.

I get more and more the impression this election got taken out of the hand of the voting population and has become a playball for the respective extreme 5% on each end. Where is the voice of reason by the remaining 90% of the US population calling the candidates off from their derailed paths to refocus on the pressing day to day issues ready to emerge after the election?

Skyrocketing unemployment, money printed beyond all means, deflationary cycles which may swing to hyperinflation, world economy risks beyond what we've seen for a long time, ~15 millions (and couting) of US households with negative equity in their mortgages, the same old solutions of drilling more to keep energy prices down (drinking faster wont increase the amount of water in a bottle), tax this and tax cut that...

Both campaigns spend too much of their resources on spin doctors, but who is offering solutions?



rich_is_bored@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 11:33 am :
That 90% is more like 8% and we'll be voting third party.



BNA!@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 1:28 pm :
rich_is_bored wrote:
That 90% is more like 8% and we'll be voting third party.


You mean the balanced minds represent the extremes? Something like radical balance...? Forced intelligence? Extremist IQ?



goliathvt@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 3:03 pm :
BNA! wrote:
I am sorry, but what has McCain to do with a mentally troubled person?


McCain campaign workers in PA started pushing the "B stands for Obama" portion of the story and emphasizing that it was a McCain volunteer attacked by an "Obama supporter," obviously trying to tap into the fear and racism of the American public. That is reprehensible, if you ask me.

Quote:
I would like to see less "blow out of proportions" approaches to politics and more focus on facts and applicable solutions. We already see far too much tribal behaviour in the press.

These things are of zip zero nothing importance, a waste of time, money and space. These are the arguments of last resort, the "your politician is worse than my politician" game which is on the same level as 4 year olds playing in a sandbox.


I agree completely. Yet all the McCain campaign seems able to muster at this point are wild, baseless attacks or yelling some mantra about "palling around with terrorists" or "ACORN is the devil!" or whatever. And, while I'd much prefer the candidates debate substantive issues, the overwhelming sling of mud coming out of the McCain campaign shouldn't go unanswered or ignored because, as I mentioned in the start of my post, just 10 years ago similar racist fear-based mud-slinging bullshit allowed the first George Bush to gain in the polls and defeat his opponent.

Quote:
I get more and more the impression this election got taken out of the hand of the voting population and has become a playball for the respective extreme 5% on each end. Where is the voice of reason by the remaining 90% of the US population calling the candidates off from their derailed paths to refocus on the pressing day to day issues ready to emerge after the election?


Actually, I've seen a voice of reason out of the Obama camp than any other presidential candidate in recent history, and that's one of the reasons why I like him. For example, while he does have ads questioning McCains ties to Charles Keating and Libby (which unlike the Obama-Ayers business, ARE real ties and friendships to convicted crooks and terrorists), he never really slammed it home during debates or public speeches. He never even allows his crowds to "boo" the other guy.

And he also has been talking to a lot more than 5% of the population in terms of the policies of his tax and health care plans. He's hardly a saint, but I've heard a lot more "this is my policy and here are my plans for office" out of Obama than I have heard from McCain. In order to get any understanding of John McCain's policies, I have to go read his website... I don't get any clear info from his campaign speeches... they're all full of venom spitting, half-truths and flag-waving bullshit.

The contrast between these two candidates is why I view "Obama" to be "better than the other crappy choices."



goliathvt@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 3:09 pm :
BNA! wrote:
rich_is_bored wrote:
That 90% is more like 8% and we'll be voting third party.


You mean the balanced minds represent the extremes? Something like radical balance...? Forced intelligence? Extremist IQ?


I think he's alluding to the fact that if you are a truly independent thinker and want to vote for a candidate that does speak a voice of reason and doesn't pander to the extremist crowd, then you're a small minority of the population and you'll probably be voting 3rd party.

If I wasn't so terrified of having yet-another-Bush-esque candidate in office, I would be voting 3rd party and not for Obama. The country, and dare I say the world, cannot handle what seems like would be the reactionary war-hawkish and economically clueless presidency of John McCain. And god forbit he died during office and Sarah "I don't know what a VP does except I want to disregard the Constitution and give me more power!" Palin took the reigns.

My vote is more "defensive" than anything else.



aardwolf@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 5:54 pm :
BNA! wrote:
I am sorry, but what has McCain to do with a mentally troubled person?

I would like to see less "blow out of proportions" approaches to politics and more focus on facts and applicable solutions. We already see far too much tribal behaviour in the press.

What does it matter for a racist that the stylist of Sarah Palin is far better paid than the political advisor of McCain? What does it matter for a radical left wing person that Obama may or may not look for his birth certificate in Hawaii?

These things are of zip zero nothing importance, a waste of time, money and space. These are the arguments of last resort, the "your politician is worse than my politician" game which is on the same level as 4 year olds playing in a sandbox.

I get more and more the impression this election got taken out of the hand of the voting population and has become a playball for the respective extreme 5% on each end. Where is the voice of reason by the remaining 90% of the US population calling the candidates off from their derailed paths to refocus on the pressing day to day issues ready to emerge after the election?

Skyrocketing unemployment, money printed beyond all means, deflationary cycles which may swing to hyperinflation, world economy risks beyond what we've seen for a long time, ~15 millions (and couting) of US households with negative equity in their mortgages, the same old solutions of drilling more to keep energy prices down (drinking faster wont increase the amount of water in a bottle), tax this and tax cut that...

Both campaigns spend too much of their resources on spin doctors, but who is offering solutions?


Dont you get it? Those big problems arent going to be addressed, so these media circuses are placed instead as a smokescreen so that the vast population will be busy with it, and dont demand these problems to be addressed. it's all a show. We're not seeing the owners of the circus, just the clowns. The owners are sitting confortably on their 1billion dollar resorts, watching all these from their holographic screens, while scheduling the next annual Bilderberg meeting.



BNA!@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 7:18 pm :
goliathvt wrote:
BNA! wrote:
rich_is_bored wrote:
That 90% is more like 8% and we'll be voting third party.


You mean the balanced minds represent the extremes? Something like radical balance...? Forced intelligence? Extremist IQ?


I think he's alluding to the fact that if you are a truly independent thinker and want to vote for a candidate that does speak a voice of reason and doesn't pander to the extremist crowd, then you're a small minority of the population and you'll probably be voting 3rd party.


I understood what he wrote, did you understand the cynicism of my reply ;)



BNA!@Posted: Sat Oct 25, 2008 7:32 pm :
aardwolf wrote:
Dont you get it? Those big problems arent going to be addressed, so these media circuses are placed instead as a smokescreen so that the vast population will be busy with it, and dont demand these problems to be addressed. it's all a show. We're not seeing the owners of the circus, just the clowns. The owners are sitting confortably on their 1billion dollar resorts, watching all these from their holographic screens, while scheduling the next annual Bilderberg meeting.


I get a whole lot more than the average person. How many people do you know personally or did you speak to attending the Bilderberg meeting? There are plenty of Bilderberg meeting in the world, every day everywhere. Basically whenever you cramp a handful of CEOs into a room in Sun Valley or elsewhere you can make an empty claim of "them" or "they" or otherwise secret "skulls" or "Freemason" conspiracy stuff.

The capital always had the power in any system, may it be capitalist or communist. Some claim with some potential logic we've seen Dick Cheney as circus owner and a public decoy named George W. Bush as the "clown" to give things a face. Is it true? Well, as true as any other construct which is of undeniable logic yet unproven.

People always believe in the mystery. God over evolution, conspiracies over monetary interest... The devils best trick was to make people believe he didn't exist, the trick of a conspiracy is to make people believe missing proof is the proof.



zeh@Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:16 am :
If what I've on the intertubes is true, she was previously a Ron Paul supporter and was kicked out the campaign work for that candidate for similar reasons, when she feigned an attack in her car.

More on McCain's campaign quick abuse of the issue:
http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpoints ... rs_inc.php



rich_is_bored@Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:18 am :
Really? Wow. How do you go from Ron Paul to McCain?



BNA!@Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 10:20 am :
rich_is_bored wrote:
Really? Wow. How do you go from Ron Paul to McCain?


She figured cutting a "B" into her face wouldn't hurt as much as a "McCain".?



zeh@Posted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:00 pm :
rich_is_bored wrote:
Really? Wow. How do you go from Ron Paul to McCain?


No idea, but I honestly think her act is a sign of some sort of racial prejudice and jumping from supporting one non-black candidate to the other in a race against a black man would be a fairly straightforward decision. Not that it applies to anyone else though.

Anyway, I didn't quite believe it at first, but apparently the thing's true btw:
http://wonkette.com/403807/ashley-todd- ... or-freedom
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08299/922849-53.stm

Quote:
In March, Ms. Todd was asked to leave a grass-roots group of Ron Paul supporters in Brazos County, Texas, group leader Dustan Costine said. He said Ms. Todd posed as a supporter of former Arkansas governor and presidential candidate Mike Huckabee and called the local Republican committee seeking information about its campaign strategies.

"She would call the opposing campaign and pretend she was on their campaign to get information," Mr. Costine said last night. "We had to remove her because of the tactics she displayed. After that we had nothing to do with her."

About a month earlier, he said, Ms. Todd sent an e-mail to the Ron Paul group saying her tires were slashed and that campaign paraphernalia had been stolen from her car because she supported Mr. Paul.

"She's the type of person who wants to be recognized," Mr. Costine said.


The girl needs help, but for one thing I'm happy she assumed she lied and ended the whole debacle so early, before it got turned into a shitstorm for both sides and tainted the discussion even more. At least she didn't believe her own lies.